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Police Helicopter Seeks Out Cannabis Factories

Tue, Feb 06, 2007 11:41 am

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THIS is the "white hot" evidence gathered by police that is being used to smash secret cannabis factories in Birmingham. (see source link for photos)

Glowing brightly against the night sky, a semi-detached home in the east of the city stands apart from its neighbours.

But that isn't a snow-covered roof - the footage from the police helicopter's thermal imaging camera actually shows the massive amount of heat being given off by a large scale cannabis factory.

Commercial-sized cannabis growing factories have sprung up in unimposing residential streets in recent years. But the police helicopter is now being regularly used to pinpoint heat being given off by the super-strong lights needed to cultivate the plants.

It has already been used in many successful operations including in Stechford, where factories have been located and people convicted and jailed.

Airborne police said the images highlighted how their on-board technology was helping to target those responsible for peddling drugs on the streets.

Sgt Paul Farley, Unit Executive Officer for the Air Operations Unit, said: "This was one of the biggest heat sources we have seen. It looked like snow on the roof.

"You have to bear in mind the production of the drug requires a tremendous amount of heat and light, which is what we look for. You can see from neighbouring houses a little bit of heat being emitted but there was a significant heat source from this property, it was markedly different. You couldn't miss it really."

He added: "This sort of image is used by officers on the ground to get the authority of the courts in order to execute search warrants."

Police have seen an explosion in the number of cannabis factories set up in houses in the West Midlands.

Drugs barons get people to pose as respectable families in order to rent out properties but then convert rooms into giant greenhouses with cannabis plants growing in virtually every room.

To avoid the massive electricity bills needed to pay for the heating, they often bypass the meter. It is estimated the factories regularly turn over tens of thousands of pounds worth of the drug which are then sold on the streets.

Sgt Farley said the helicopter is called in by officers investigating the existence of drugs factories in a bid to confirm their suspicions.

The helicopter makes sweeps of the roof-tops in the hunt for the tell-tale heat sources. The images are then used secure search warrants.

Sgt Farley said that no matter what the gangs did to cover their illegal tracks the drug factories still stood out a mile.

He said: "I am sure they do their very best to try to suppress the heat but heat has to escape from the building somewhere. It can't just disappear and if it is diverted somewhere else we'll spot it."

The helicopter has been used in several high-profile operations across the city recently.

Earlier this year, police seized £250,000 from a property in Quinton and found several hundred cannabis plants with a street value of nearly £250,000.

The house looked so much like an ordinary semi that neighbours even sent Christmas cards to the new tenants unaware they had turned it into a drugs factory.

Last March police recovered £300,000 worth of cannabis from a Victorian property in Station Road, Stechford. More than 1,000 plants were being grown in 14 rooms. Two Vietnamese men were later jailed for three years for cannabis production.

A few weeks later police in Stechford smashed more cannabis factories after raiding a number of other addresses in the area.

And in July police called to deal with a minor street row found a string of houses across Birmingham and Warwickshire turned into cannabis factories. At one house they found 1,200 plants.


» add a comment

LED vs HPS

Apr 3 2010, 6:12 pm

After you check out 420magazine.com in the "grow" section then go in to the "journals in progress" you can see pictures and actual testing of LED lights such as the Haight solid state and the popular HGL Hydrogrow lights as well as HPS grows, I believe your eyes can answer the question about led's, the blooming part from the LED's leaves you with small but crusty buds, on the other hand HPS gives you massive buds.
check it out it's all at 420magazine they have great pics and illustration. I would recommend the HSS VS HGL grow by Setting sun.

Krek.

Apr 22 2009, 5:08 pm

In Holland, they even use HTC-sniffers to make sure it is really weed growing and not tomatoes. The unmanned autonomous helicopters of Jan Verhagen (http://www.verhagenx2.com) can fly automated patterns through suspect areas to detect growers. We don't only produce the best weed, we also make the best canasniffers!

WeedWiz

May 26 2007, 7:46 am

I can tell you as a matter of FACT:
Do not shoot at the helicopters !!!!! They will take EVERYTHING you have and then some !!!

Getting Closer Part 3 of3

Feb 11 2007, 4:31 am

INTRIGUING STUFF ABOUT PROXIMITY IN HERE:

Distance - Just keep the LED's at least 6" away from the plants for best results. If the LED light gets any closer than 6" weird stuff can happen. The leaves could start to grow in curls and spirals and flowering could start very rapidly!!!!! I have experimented with CLOSE PROXIMITY LED growing and the plants do really wild things, its kind of fun to see and it does not hurt the plant! I have had flowers start growing upside down when growing right up against the LED bulb. The plants love it but they can grow strangely when very close to the LED's. For best results 12" to 16" away from the plant is the best. Also plants can go through LED shock. The light from an LED is so potent that many plants will not grow for the first two weeks when you first put them under the LED light for the first time. Think of it as over fertilizing a plant,,, to much of a good thing is not good. To avoid LED shock you can start by putting the light about 40" away from the plants and moving it closer every few days until its about 12" to 16" away. LED shock is not fatal but the plants undoubtedly think they have seen the 'LIGHT GOD' and kind of freak out for a little while if you put the LED's right on top of them all of a sudden.

http://cgi.ebay.ca/LED-Grow-Light-R-B-66-FULL-growing-lights-Orchid-12-PK_W0QQitemZ290078845140QQihZ019QQcategoryZ42225QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

END

blessingsandpeace

Getting Closer Part 2

Feb 11 2007, 4:28 am

Control Over Your Plants - The most important benefit to LED light is that you have full control over the wave lengths of Red and Blue light ! The amounts of red and blue light can be precisely controlled. Light can be placed exactly where you need it most. I have placed a Red LED right against the surface of many plants actually touching the areas most likely to produce a flower including orchids, and few days later flower buds started to form! Amazing!!! The level of growth manipulation and control that LEDs can offer the grower are only just now being barely explored. We have manipulated tiny seedlings with excess red light and in just weeks watched them burst into flowers. We have controlled annuals with excess blue light into thinking summer was never going to end and made them last for many years while turning them into monstrously large plants! LED growing is in its initiatory period and much more will be learned in the exciting years to come!

Getting Closer, Part 1

Feb 11 2007, 4:22 am

This guy sells them on ebay:

ADVANTAGES OF LED PLANT LIGHTS LEDs vs. HID


Long Life! - The useful life of our 3rd generation LEDs is 150,000 hours plus burning 24 hours a day! This is called the 'Alaskan Summer' LED growing method is the best way to grow with LEDs! In LED growing, growers do not make hormonal changes in the plant by giving it more or less simulated night or day light! Instead a plants growth characteristic are manipulated by simply adding more blue or red light in the 24 hour per day non-stop LED growing methodology established by the professional LED growers of today.

Energy Efficient - Save 95% on your power bills over HPS / HID lighting. Also consider all of the other reduced power consumption caused by blowers, filters, air conditioning and the usual repairs like ballasts, transformers and over heated bulbs, etc.

Better for plant growth - Plants can use nearly all of the light emitted from LED lamps. Wasted energy in metal halide lamps can be calculated in not only efficient use of the light wave lengths but also by massive losses of just wasted HEAT energy! LEDs are just warm to the touch. LED lights produce very little heat. The temperature of our growing areas is controlled by normal residential AC/heating and a ceiling fan. In most situations, no special ventilation or air conditioning is needed.

Thanx

Feb 10 2007, 10:05 pm

For the clarification on the orchid basket.

Off topic, but i don't have cable tv, and I just saw prince performing songs on the superbowl half time on youtube.com
He blew me away.
Dude still has it, and I know the weed in me is not the reason I say this.
If ya havnt seen it, check it out on youtube. You won't be sorry.

An Orchid Basket...

Feb 10 2007, 6:49 pm

Is a lightweight plastic flowerpot shaped basket with openings too small for grow rocks to fall through but big enough for roots to pass.

It also has a small rim around the top so it can be suspended from a hole in a bucket top or a flat top to a hyrdo tank.

Check out "My Vision" below for a sure fire DWC setup.

This really isn't as easy for you new guys as it was for me. I had OverGrow.com to learn from with photos and everything. There are so any books out there now it makes your head swim to try to pick one.

'been thinking about organizing my own notes. photos and documentation into a specialized booklet about my own modular DWC grow system.

One photo-filled booklet to cover everything from cloning moms to water-cured harvests in your own tiny little apartment! I just need to work on the solar powered LEDs chapter first!

For now google deep water culture and prepare yourself to wade in.

what

Feb 10 2007, 1:02 pm

Is an orchid basket?
I think everyone knows what an orchid is, but?

BIG THANK YOU DWC

Feb 10 2007, 12:16 pm

Sorry to sound so clueless trying to get off on the right foot an achive most bang for the buck

The USE of infrared.

Feb 10 2007, 11:33 am

A heat signature alone is insufficient to warrant a search here in the states. This Birmingham is in the UK and evidently their standards for probable cause are somewhat less rigorous. The use of heat signature tech is a straight up violation of the right to privacy, but its use is analogous to a polygraph. Can't really use it in court, but it can leads the fuzz in the right direction. What a waste of f...... money, time and resources. Catch some genuine criminals bitches!

When I Think LED

Feb 10 2007, 8:28 am

I think power consumption, which is what this heat-seeking whirlypig article is about. The websites claim that the LEDs actually can replace a 400watt HPS grow lite. I wanna see that before investing!

I'm sure fine-tuning the reds and blues will be big in the near future and we're only at the start of this wave.

(Yep, those urls are in this thread.)

Deep Water Culture

Feb 10 2007, 8:13 am

It means to plant in water, literally! An orchid basket of grow rocks is suspended over a bucket of grow formula which is overamped with air bubbles.

The roots go down into the aerated formula and never touch soil at all. The growth rate is unreal and nutrient control is complete.

As an added bonus no dirt means no bugs! ... and of course no watering!

peace

YO?

Feb 10 2007, 7:50 am

what does DWC stand for in the grow set up?
Thanks

LED

Feb 10 2007, 7:46 am

I'g guessing LED to be wave of future,because you can pick your color spectrums= adding more red in budding box can't hurt
Adding blue to your clone/vegative box ect.

has any one sent you to
led-grow-master.com or

growwithleds.com or

dansdata.com/letters159.html

Well, That's Too Bad!

Feb 10 2007, 6:05 am

To No

I've contributed a butt-load of data to this thread. Maybe someone with actual experience will read this and share later.

No, my impatient friend, this stuff is too new for High Times (Although I've seen LED banner ads here) and that's all right. But it isn't too new for certain readers. I don't mean to bore you but if you read back you'll see I'm not the only one interested.

If I google up any more useful info or links I'll continue to add them here until the inevitable LED article arrives, by your leave.

peace

NO! They Don't!

Feb 10 2007, 2:58 am

Dude you need to e-mail the questions you have to high times.

You can set up a fake e-mail address and have someone that knows the info you want to know.

And have you tried Google?

If you can't find it there you won't find it anywhere.

Beating A Dead Horse!

Feb 9 2007, 7:52 pm

(What an awful old expression!!)

Does anyone have experience using LED grow lites? 8}

Brother Woody

Feb 9 2007, 3:37 am

'been growin' and tokin' for ten years here in medical Cali.

I entertain my guests in the living room and never let anyone into my bedroom. A second bedroom would work better!

I wouldn't say anything here either if I wasn't running an internet anonymity program, Tor.

I DWC grow 8-9lbs in my little apt every year and work my day job.

I've kept my mouth shut and suffer minimal paranoia because I stay within my city's grow limits.

I learned most of what I know on overgrow.com and I don't discuss my bedroom acivities with anyone. 8}

I'm very happy here in town but I might still go camping again sometime.

$$$$ The Woods $$$$$

Feb 9 2007, 3:08 am

yea.I can see where your coming from:

BUT.What about the negatives of indoor grows????

What if a fire gets started some where in the house.Fire dept. comes out and finds the grow.

Break ins.Yea,you go to a movie and some meth addict breaks in and discovers your grow...

Always frieghtened when a plane or helecopter flies over.Is that the one with the thermal imaging???

If the grow is discovered in any kind of way it is kinda hard to say it wasn't yours...

AND you probably would have to grow several plants indoors to yeild as much from just one outdoor plant...


Just some thoughts about it.

Hey Woodsman

Feb 9 2007, 2:21 am

Good luck to you out in the spooky old woods brother! I have smelled myself after a week in the woods and I'd rather not go back there again!

Why would you want to isolate yourself in the bugs and dirt in a tent when you can be a perfectly composed gentleman-farmer right here in town?

There are many, many garage, basement and warehouse size grows which never get busted you know. Start small & find your comfort zone.

Grow all you want, just keep your mouth shut and live a normal life dude, like me!

Growing in the day, showering and going to dinner and the movies at night... better than keeping your hiked-in food away from the bears and sleeping in a dirty ol' tent!

I'm a city boy, not a nature boy! I must reject your advice sir!

$$$$$ The Woods $$$$$

Feb 9 2007, 1:43 am

Forget about any kind of lights...
Quit your jobs and get well educated in wilderness survival...

Now go into the woods with food and supplies...

GROW,GROW,and GROW!!!!!


After one season of this if you done it right....

You can retire and buy good smoke from time to time from someone else that is growing and taking the risk...


Don't be scared and don't come out of the woods for nothing...

You will need enough food to survive on and a clean water source and some shelter...

All though,I would rather work alone...You really need at least one partner,that you can trust...

Alot of areas are never flown over by cops and if your there with the stuff you can see and hear everything that goes on...


Fields the size of a big suv...YEA!!! Fields of DREAMS!

cool

Feb 9 2007, 1:08 am

For without love in this world, it would be a sad place indeed...

No Problemo, Bud!

Feb 9 2007, 12:55 am

I thought maybe my feminine side was making big joke on me!

I've got news for you though, I also do loveandblessings! and I really mean it people!

SMART POT PEOPLE! I LOVE YOU!

well

Feb 9 2007, 12:39 am

After reviewing, she signed it love and peace :-)

lol

Feb 9 2007, 12:15 am

Oh sorry dude,
I got you confused with the stoner gal who I thought ended her letter in the past with love and blessings.

Dude, Not Gal Sir!

Feb 9 2007, 12:06 am

I'm not a stoner gal, compadre.

Why would you associate my writing with being from a female? Is it my long hair?

Talk about an open mind!

confusedhippie8}

wow!

Feb 8 2007, 11:41 pm

Ya just have to love the stoner gals inginuity! ;-)

And Smoke Control Too!

Feb 8 2007, 6:40 pm

At the other end, hopefully, of the grow is the smoke. My little kitchen has an exhaust vent in the wall over the stove.

I've run a flexible 1 1/2" plastic hose from that vent all the way along the ceiling to my comfy chair in the living room.

I combined three 2 liter bottles into a single cigar shaped chamber. The middle one is cut off wide at both ends and is black taped between the other two. The top one is carefully cut to fit the hose at the top and the bottom is cut wide open. The bottom 2 liter bottle is cut wide open at the top and 3/4s open at the bottom.

The whole thing hangs within easy reach between two seats with velcro to park it into place over the ashtray at the ready!

Now when I turn on the exhaust fan in the kitchen I can blow my smoke from my comfy chair straight up to the apartment building's roof!

peaceandblessings!

An Industrious Thread!

Feb 8 2007, 5:38 pm

It has been good to see that I'm not the only one interested in this horizon subject. LEDs will dominate the future and there will be a more or less standard confguration eventually.

As for the ordorifics involved with growing Da' Kine I have some experience solving my own problem.

The little bitty "particles of smell" tend to bunch up in any given room. This is evident when we leave an open bag o' buds and come back later. The same holds true for live plants but to a lesser degree.

I run three 2x4 400w DWC mini-grow stations which I've described in other threads. I also keep a fourth setup full of 12 little moms of various strains.

Finally there are three little shelves of clones in cubes sitting in a weak aerated formula up to the cube brims in flat trays. The clones will root completely unattended.

All four of the grow stations and the clonies are located in the bedroom of my tiny little one bedroom apartment, along with my king size bed.

Each one of those three mini-grows puts out 3lbs a year. So,Hhw do I handle the smell??!?!

Its very simple. I have two 20" exhaust fans in the bedroom windows, several oscillating fans around the room, and for very hot days the hood fans get turned on and dump into the LIVING ROOM, not out the windows!

You see, all I do is break up any pockets or concentrations of them tiny little "odor particles". I just keep them moving around and diluting until they are safe to simply go out the windows. No charcol no ozone no problem

Been doing it in this crowded little canyon of tall apartments for ten years now.

I love this little place!

umm

Feb 8 2007, 11:26 am

I should make it clear that i dont think weed smells bad. I meant to say the ozone stinks.

umm

Feb 8 2007, 11:16 am

Maybe an led setup would make more potent plants.
There is one more problem to hurtle. Well, two.
A light box could trap the light to keep nosey eyes from spying,
but the smell. That unmistakable smell would be hard to mask.
An ozone generator may work, but they stink so bad.
Neighbors I would think would smell a potent plant growing. If only they could come out with a plant with no smell. Has anyone heard of that?

thanks for the links

Feb 8 2007, 7:46 am

many thanks for the links.
now at least i am able to make a more informed decision
please post any others on the LED subject

Ya Yah

Feb 8 2007, 3:56 am

Theory is the way we push out the envelope, and make ourselves crazy!

Execution is the only way to prove theories.

With all of the commercially available LED grow lights today I still think somebody reading this thread probably knows SOMEBODY with real LED stripes. Huh?

onemorequestion

Feb 8 2007, 3:37 am

Didn't i read somewhere that light gets exponentialy brighter the closer it is? well if it is one millimeter away, how do you calculate lux at 1 mm away?
I'm boggled.

Ya Huh

Feb 8 2007, 3:19 am

There are some truly bizzare regular, commercial LED configurations out there too!

Follow this url to the bottom of the page. There you will find a pinapple / medieval mace lookin' screw-in bulb contraption studded in all directions in a cylindrical pattern with LEDs!

http://www.theledlight.com/120-VAC-LEDbulbs.html

Just drop a few of these between your stalks for plenty 'o deep penetration!

This is a very exciting transition time similar to the pre-dot com computer era. There was a whole landscape of new technologies being born then, anyone remember Netscape?

With whirlypigs on the hunt for heat signatures what better use of technology can we embrace?

An LED light which promises to do the same job at one third the power and one fourth the heat is a very good fit to my purposes!

umm

Feb 8 2007, 3:05 am

I think they should try making sheets of steel or aluminum like lithograph sheets with hundreds of leds, that surround the plant, but I think they should have different diameters for different stages of growth. That way, the light could be the closest to the plant at all stages of development. Pinching back and bending the tips could keep it the size desired.

re: ya

Feb 8 2007, 2:58 am

It might penetrate better if you were to surround the plant with hundreds of leds, rather than just the top side

No of

Feb 8 2007, 2:58 am

Follow the urls. We have many, many configurations to model after... which is why I'm searching for a known entity.

To copy it.

Ya, Verbatum

Feb 8 2007, 2:55 am

There's comparison between LEDs and Standard Lights which didn't copy well but you can figure it out.

LED, Standard
yes, no etc.

'sorry about that.

They say 1" LED distance from plant compared to 24" HID. That doesn't translate into very much canopy penetration, does it?

of

Feb 8 2007, 2:47 am

Course how many leds would you have to put in the holes? Again that burning question looms. Too many leds, would be a waste of electricity. Not enough leds would cause stem elongation, and spindely flimsy thin worthless plants.
What we have here is uncharted territory.

Verbatum

Feb 8 2007, 2:47 am

LED Grow Lights vs. HID

Why HID Lights Look So Bright
In-house Vegetative Growth Comparison
University of Minnesota Vegetative Growth Comparison

A number of issues determine the efficiency of a lighting system. They include:

* Heat generated by the bulbs
* Heat generated by ballasts
* The fraction of the light used by plants
* Service and maintenance costs

When all the above are taken into account, only about 10% of the power consumed by HID systems is actually used by plants. For a 1000-watt MH bulb, about 100 watts of useful energy reach the plants. In contrast, much more of the power consumed by LEDs becomes useable light.

When comparing the overall performance of LED grow lights with HID lights, a figure to keep in mind is overall cost per yield over a 2-3 year period. This includes the initial cost of lights, energy, ventilation, heating and cooling and the replacement cost of bulbs and other components.
LED Grow Lights Standard HID
Tunable spectrum YES No
PAR 100% 30-35%
Typical bulb temperature 105 OF 1,200 OF
Recommended minimum distance from plants 1 inch (single color) 24 inches
Service life 50,000 hours 20,000 hours
Instant restart YES No
Can use low voltage YES No
Primary spectrum output Red and blue Yellow and green
Fire hazard NO Yes
Ballast required NO Yes
Noise NO- Silent Yes

Comparing Lumens
Comparing lumens from LED grow lights with that for HID lights is not a valid comparison for gauging plant growth potential. A lumen is a measurement of light that is based on the sensitivity of the human eye. This means that the for same amount of light energy, green light will measure about 10 times the lumens of the blue or red light. Since plants use mostly blue and red light, lumens are not really an appropriate index of plant growing efficiency. We gauge the effectiveness of our lights on actual plant growth.

oh

Feb 8 2007, 2:42 am

And i would paint the fan white to reflect the light back down into the grow.
I'd also use white paper to cover the soil to reflect more light back up into the grow.

ifitwereme

Feb 8 2007, 2:39 am

I know that leaves follow the light. So I would wrap a lightweight sheet of steel around the plant with hundreds of closely spaced holes. I would sit a low speed computer power supply fan on the top.
That simple. Actually, the hardest thing to do right, would be in the drilling. A carbide tipped drill bit would prove essential. And alot of patients. Oh maybe i should move to canada so I could enjoy that setup:-)

My Vision Grow

Feb 8 2007, 2:28 am

Would be a combination of upright corner tubes and overhead LED lamps. The more I look into it the more appealing a DIY approach is starting to look.

Starting with a perforated board and a pile of extra strength LEDS it would not take very long to fabricate a few 6"x6" power array lamp heads in the time it takes to research the various internet claims and view those outlandish prices for the early systems!

How about mounting eight of these LED power heads on hanging goosenecks mounted on rails for exact light targeting, Medusa style?

LEDs and flourescent tubes will present a 1/3 fraction of the heat put out by the present grow lights combo, not to mention the power bill, and may make mini-solar possible.

and

Feb 8 2007, 2:23 am

I read that 10 lux is equal to 1 foot candle, according to wikipedia on lux.
Remember that lux, is measured like a foot away. What I'm gettin at is its hard to predict mathmatically the true lux at 1mm away when you have beam angles to predict, and you have to convert mcd to candle, then convert candle to lux to see if the light is equal to out door light, and then to confuse the subject further, i think i read that lux is the measurement of visible light, so does red and blue light effect the lux measurement's true intensity. I'd say it should. One more question. Because plants grow better in the red and blue spectrum, do they then require less lux for a good grow?
Only time will tell, cause someone will do scientific study eventually.
Man I can't believe I am getting so into this. Wish I could join in on the fun. Enjoy your selves...

About Lights And Plants

Feb 8 2007, 2:11 am

First about sunlight, it contains the rainbow from purples to reds and everything we can't even see.

Metal Halide contains mostly yellow/white and the blue end.

High Pressure Sodium contains mostly yellow/white and the red end.

Plants love red and blue but don't care all that much about yellow/green/white.

We see yellow/white best and are most impressed by what incandescent lights we see.

But these LED lights also transmit a lot of light we simply don't see in addition to what is visible to us, so its hard for us to compare the two.

or

Feb 8 2007, 2:00 am

Look at it this way. The brighter the light outside, the more sunscreen you have to use to prevent sunburn, so it stands to reason, the more closely, the light is to the plant, the more sunscreen "thc" it will produce.

also

Feb 8 2007, 1:34 am

I think it is critical to keep the leds real close to the plant, like one millimeter to prevent elongation. Elongation of the stem = wasted veg growth.
People forget that the fresh LIVE thc produced is very potent, and a little goes a long ways. Ya don't need a 20' tall plant to give you a good hit. You just need more light intensity. I read where thc is produced by the plant to shield the plant from the light. Like sunglasses shields our eyes. The brighter the light, the bigger the shield. Or more thc in the plant. Welding goggles use a huge shield to protect our eyes from arc welding.
When I see people in those pictures show led lights feet away, it makes me shake my head. Cause I have read that cannabis is a power plant, meaning the more light you give it, the better it thrives. Barring too much heat, "you don't want to burn the plant", and a lack of co2. Wish I could grow in my state, cause I'd like to smell that skunky smell of life in my house.

hmm

Feb 8 2007, 1:01 am

I guess the question is, is how many leds does it take to equal 100,000 lux?
I'm not talking about the those 3 watt leds either.
I'm talking about the bright but cheaper $10.00 for 100 kind. They last much longer and they are alot cheaper.

My Grow, My Vision.

Feb 8 2007, 12:37 am

What works for me:

A 2x4 shelf rack, 16 gal. tub on bottom level, 2x4 hyrdo tank just above with hole cut out of shelf for drain tubes.

A small pump trickles hyro formula from tub to tank and overflow drains back into tub. A circulating pump is in the hydro tank with bubble wands on bed.

A painted plywood cover has twelve 3 1/2" holes for orchid baskets and grow rocks. Each corner of this mini grow room has a vertical pair of 48" flourescent fixtures to light dark corners and a 400w MH/HPS lamp overhead.

I pull 3lbs out of this DWC corner of my bedroom year after year.

I want to convert to LEDs for just the overhead lamp and keep everything else in place.

You know?

I've read

Feb 8 2007, 12:31 am

That plants elongate when the light is less than 100,000 lux. If this is true, and you want a short plant like 10 inches high, then I'd say the led lights would work.
Bending and tying the tops with a bread tie should keep the stem short. Flooding it from all sides should make a very stinky bud.
100 leds can be bought for around $10.00 on ebay.
Seems like ask ed columns are needed again in hightimes to answer questions, and put an end to the guessing, cause i just dont know for sure.

we was thinking

Feb 8 2007, 12:14 am

the ad @ eco green star grow bar, claims each bar has 250wat of lumens
we ws considering adding as side lighting on 3 sides to complement a 400 or 1000 wat
if 2 grow bars per side- well I dont have the figures at hand-but lets say a 6'x6'budding chamber.
ok thats 1000mh on top with 500 wat in LED lumens x 3 sides=1500 more wats. that gives you like 200 wats per foot, i would guess this to greatly increase yield, if ya can keep them watered, might need to add co2 at this point

To Opinion

Feb 8 2007, 12:13 am

Thank you for your input. There is nothing theoretical about LED grow lights. If you check any of the urls indicated in this thread you'll see serious activity.

Cannabisculture.com has two interesting LED threads.

This is the future calling but I'm using a guaranteed HPS system now and I don't want to chance a hefty chunk of change until I see someone else's results.

You know?

correction

Feb 7 2007, 10:09 pm

I meant to say blue and red

inmyfihnopinion

Feb 7 2007, 10:08 pm

I've never done it, but from what ive read, i would think that if a person were to bend the tops to keep the stem short, and pinch the veg back when to big, i would guess it would work for one plant, but just one. Thats my guess, cause the leds only emit light at a narrow beam angle, and you need to have the leds as close as possible and try to get 100,000 lux. Which is difficult. I would say its possible though cause the emit light in the blue and green making them more efficient. If i werent a chicken shit, id try it myself.

Aspiring LED Guy

Feb 7 2007, 8:29 pm

Thanks for the data post. I'm NOT interested in picking up my old solding iron to build an LED array myself!

There are many budding manufacturers out there but I just want someone to tell of his/her actual experience.

These very cool running engergy misers claim to pack the same punch as HID lites!

http://www.ledgrowlights.com/

http://www.led-grow-master.com/services.html

http://www.growwithleds.com/

I'd like to set up a 400w HPS equivelent LED DWC grow and power it up with solar. I just want to know someone else's real-life use of LEDs.

STILL

Feb 7 2007, 7:07 pm

huhuhu, well, hahahahaha, hahahaha, okok

another one bites the dust

and another one gone and another one gone

another one bites the dust

bob

Feb 7 2007, 6:55 pm

pissing people off* (im veryvery high)

to the LED guy

Feb 7 2007, 6:50 pm

check out this link for info on growing with LEDs

http://www.dansdata.com/danletters159.htm

for LED answers ask

Feb 7 2007, 6:26 pm

Jorge Cervantes

one of the best pot grower in the world. if anyone knows he does.

So, No LED Experience?

Feb 7 2007, 6:10 pm

Seeing websites selling low-watt grow LEDs, even if they have data and a sales speel, is not enough for me.

Does anyone know a guy who knows a guy whos knows someone who's actually used them?

There is negligible temperature associated with any Light Emitting Diode light.

UNDERGROUND???

Feb 7 2007, 5:29 pm

HAVE YOU EVER CONSIDERED THE EXTREME AMOUNT OF WORK REQUIRED TO EXCAVATE AN UNDERGROUND GROW ROOM???

IT CAN'T BE ANY EASIER TO HIDE THAT A HUGE LEAD SHEET.

AND IF YOU ARE THAT FUCKING WORRIED ABOUT GROWING LIGHTS GIVING YOU AWAY THEN GROW ORGANIC OUTDOORS.

not that any of this shit about growing matters to me...i don't need to grow, i let other folks take that risk for me. i just enjoy the fruits of their labor.

BC

Feb 7 2007, 4:11 pm

Why do they waste their time on something that grows naturally and just gives people munchies and makes them smile a lot. Let it grow. Let it blossom, let it grow.

lying mother f?*&^r

Feb 7 2007, 3:49 pm

i like the, wheres and Iraqi when you need em

Normal Dave from Boston.

Feb 7 2007, 2:57 pm

Fuck anyone trying to ban the most beutiful thing in the world. I hope someone comes into office soon in the white house and supports and legalize's weed, again I am getting sick of paying high prices for a little sticky when our brother's from Canada pay very little for it. U guys are very lucky up there I will hopefully live there in a couple of years to really enjoy what I love . Power 2 the people !

what about me Ron Jeremy

Feb 7 2007, 2:45 pm

yeah but how do you buy 1" inch sheets of lead and move it without everybody in the neighbor hood knowing, cause you have to rent a crane or hire 30 people to pick it up. then you have to weld the seems so no heat can expell. unless your like me and have 30 drug attict friends, but wait then you probably have a free weed hookup so why grow? who is going to help you

go underground
and plant in a forest

Gpower

Feb 7 2007, 10:33 am

Dirty, filthy, nasty pigs!! Go find a fucking meth lab for fuck sakes. Who and what exactly is cannabis hurting?? No-damn-body. Except those who smoke it, when we get busted for some bullshit offense. It pains me to think my tax dollars go towards this filth and degradation. Woes me.

Ron Paul for president.

Feb 7 2007, 10:19 am

Oh and Obama is paid off just like Bush, and Billiary.

Ron Paul A Real American Choice.

Fucking Stupid

Feb 7 2007, 10:01 am

I think harvard grad is a hightimes editor just riling us up.

Man fuck the police.

shoot it down

Feb 7 2007, 6:31 am

shoot it down, where is an iraqi when we need one

Your Maker

Feb 7 2007, 5:48 am

VOTE FOR OBAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Any LED Experience?

Feb 7 2007, 3:21 am

Low-energy, high-intensity LED grow lights... anybody? Very low temperature!

I'm seeing them for sale out there but, anyone tried them?

loveandblessings!

re-Tardius

Feb 7 2007, 3:04 am

This shit is going on all over the world and them narcs even have hand held infrared devices that firemen use for detecting hot spots in a fire.
It's best to use your lights during daylight hours as much as possible.Its at night when they can see with the infared the best so why grow at night ?Thats so ReTarded.

Smokin' Gud Cali 'Tard!

Feb 7 2007, 12:14 am

Yep! Ahm extra 'tarded out 'bout now but those other guys are still right. Heat recording still does happens over here too don't cha know?

Gud'n retarded in Cali!

you're all tards

Feb 6 2007, 11:40 pm

this takes place in europe not the us. that is why there dea and supreme court have nothing to do with it. its in the u.k.

Harv Grad's Dad

Feb 6 2007, 11:32 pm

Harvard Grad's Dad jacked off into a flower pot,and raised a blooming idiot

Anaujiram

Feb 6 2007, 10:54 pm

Harv Tard is just as full of shit as the sizzlin ass bacon that was on the copter in the article. Harv Tard thinks just like they do that we are stupid for using this plant. But what all the others in Harv Tards group dont realize is that their reality is bullshit to me. Harv Tard will die an old man never realizing the things his mind was capable of. HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HARV TARD HAHAHAHAHAHAHA HARV TARD HARV TARD HAHAHAHA Harvard Grad U R A Dumbass and you make me smile everyday because I am not as pathetic as you are!! HAHAHA

Harv Tard beat down

Feb 6 2007, 9:28 pm

The only bitch i see is Harv Tard. what a useless waste of space, ur dad should of pulled out. Your existence will make abortion legal forever, because u are an ABORTION POSTER CHILD.

Okay I'll Bite.

Feb 6 2007, 8:33 pm

How DOES it feel being such a dumbass, Turdboy?

Harvard Graduate

Feb 6 2007, 8:03 pm

Yeah bitches! You can't hide from the law. I just have one question for you, how does it feel being a dumbass???????

oh

Feb 6 2007, 7:54 pm

Who cares if its illegal or not. You know the dea will do any damn thing they want. Just move to a more civilized society. The day of usa greatness is long gone.

Turdboy Drooling..

Feb 6 2007, 7:53 pm

... we are watching you, imitation cop Turdboy!

An infrared scan CAN be used in conjunction with other existing probable causes for a cumulative effect. Just like using power consumption is not enough alone but when combined with other movements and observations can result in a warrant.

mystrimarc

Feb 6 2007, 7:29 pm

I THOUGHT THE U.S. SURPREME COURT RULED A SEARCH OF SOMEONE'S HOME BY INFERRED HEAT DETECTION WAS AN ILLEGAL SEARCH. A case ruled on from the state of Oregon. So why are narcs riding around in helicopters doing this in Birmingham?

Hah Hah Hah!

Feb 6 2007, 7:16 pm

Everrrybody into thee peeuwool!

Yabba Dabba Doo!

No really! That's okay. It's a long way to my neighbor's mansion.

the pool idea

Feb 6 2007, 6:46 pm

is feasable, but by the time it was harvest season anyone in a 5 block radius will smell the wonderful perfume of the buds and come drooling/floating to the source like fred flintstone to wilma's cooking.

uhhh.....??

Feb 6 2007, 6:43 pm

clinton
julianni
nader
gore
osama...uh...i mean obama


who do you pick?

i would never let a name like obama in office, call me racist or whatever, but the name barack obama doesn't seem like the name of an american president.

every american president has been white, male and a mason.

i don't think they will change the format for this guy.

Cheech and Chong...

Feb 6 2007, 6:39 pm

... did a movie called "Nice Dreams" where they had the run of a mansion with a large swimming pool.

The pool had no water but featured a camo tarp painted like water, complete with a girl on a raft!

Meanwhile, under the tarp was a major science grow!

With today's advanced materials I wonder how hard it would be to fabricate a convincing cover which would still transmit enough light for a outdoor solar grow inside an empty pool? No lights needed, no heat detection.

You could even have a short secret tunnel to your own mansion!

justromulating

umm

Feb 6 2007, 6:05 pm

I believe it was obama who said that smoking pot was a mistake he made, so if true, obama would be another loser.

VOTE FOR BARACK OBAMA 08'

Feb 6 2007, 5:22 pm

VOTE OBAMA FOR PRESIDENT 08. SO HE CAN RESTORE ARE PRIVACY WICH IS GRANTED IN THE CONSTITUTION. THERES NO LIBERAL AMERICA.. OR CONSERVATIVE AMERICA.. THIS IS THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA HOME OF THE FREE. LET OBAMA MAKE IT THAT PLACE AGAIN!!! HES A MAN REALLY FOR THE PEOPLE!!

to just

Feb 6 2007, 4:36 pm

i think a lead roof would be a little easier to accomplish than an underground operation.

White heat- Shmite Shmeet

Feb 6 2007, 2:06 pm

Everyone agrees that there is a market for it. So, the government should produce it for the cancer patients, and anyone else over 21.

Goldenseed

Feb 6 2007, 1:53 pm

Much more interesting with the picture....

http://www.goldenseed.co.uk/imageshtml/whiteheat.jpg

just

Feb 6 2007, 1:01 pm

build your entire grow opperation under ground on a farm away from anything and plant trees over the top. they dont fly over forests with the thermal camera on

i've heard

Feb 6 2007, 12:38 pm

i've heard it said that an air cooled lead barrier of proper thickness can hide the heat of a grow op from the thermal camera.

Fly over this!

Feb 6 2007, 12:36 pm

http://www.polyshield.ca/

Milton

Feb 6 2007, 12:12 pm

Factories ? Is there any job openings at these factories they sure sound productive.

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